RE: [ebxml-dev] The CEFACT website horribly out of date

Hi Steve,

    Do you happen to have a list of or pointers to the
things about ebxml that you compiled? I am sure
something like this is going to be useful to folks
like me, who are trying to extract useful information
>from noise.

Thanks,
Nagendra.

--- Steve Capell <> wrote:
> 
> Despite not wanting to spam, I do feel obliged to
> support the statements
> regarding the state of ebXML websites.  I have felt
> for some time that the
> biggest barrier to success (by far) is awareness,
> training and marketing -
> and not the technical progress of the working
> groups.
> 
> No matter how high the qaulity of the standards, for
> the ebXML framework to
> be successful, it must be used.  That cannot happen
> until a very large
> number of people have moved from ignorance through
> awareness to
> understanding and commitment.  A website with good
> quality materials at all
> levels from promotional brochures through white
> papers, to detailed
> self-training materials is the most scalable way to
> achieve that objective.
> 
> Speaking for myself, it took some very considerable
> effort to piece together
> the components of the ebXML puzzle from various
> websites, presentations,
> mailing lists, two books, and some sample code.   
> The majority of potential
> ebXML "customers" will have no compelling reason to
> go to this level of
> effort and so will just brush ebXML aside and choose
> some other solution to
> their business problems.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Steve Capell
> RedWahoo
> Sydney, Australia
> Tel : +61 410 437854
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jouko Salonen
> [mailto:]
> Sent: Friday, 4 October 2002 4:14 PM
> To: Todd Boyle; 
> Subject: RE: [ebxml-dev] The CEFACT website horribly
> out of date
> 
> 
> 
> Agree with Todd. It does not make ebXML-evangelizing
> easier.
> Unfortunately Todd's proposal
> >"The page should say "The CEFACT
> >ebXML Avtivity ended in May 2001 and was succeeded
> by its
> >ebTWG Activity http://www.ebtwg.org"
> >does not help too much. In general (there are
> exceptions, though)
> ebTWG-pages give almost as strong out of date and
> "closed" feeling as CEFACT
> does.
> 
>
http://www.ebtwg.org/projects/documentation/bpschema/ppt/BPSS2-Project-Statu
> s-12Oct01.ppt
> HTTP 404 - File not found
> 
> http://www.ebtwg.org/groups/ebtwg.html
> Sign-Up Page under re-construction! (and has been as
> long as I remember!)
> 
> Jouko Salonen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Todd Boyle [mailto:]
> Sent: 3. lokakuuta 2002 22:52
> To: 
> Subject: [ebxml-dev] The CEFACT website horribly out
> of date
> 
> 
> Go to the homepage.
> http://www.unece.org/cefact/index.htm
> 
> Click on some of the links, for example "XML
> Initiative" for example.
> First of all the title is almost patronizing,
> alongside so many other
> activities that use XML.  Clearly the author of this
> site is predisposed
> to position the EDIFACT and eDOCs stuff as the
> "real" solutions.
> 
> Anyway the  "XML Initiative" link goes to this page:
> http://www.unece.org/cefact/xml/xml_main.htm
> 
>     Experts can join any project team(s), with the
> condition they register
>     their participation via the ebXML's web site.
> Participation can either
>     be via a list server only (virtual) or by
> attending ebXML meetings.
> 
>     For further information on how to subscribe,
> please click on "ebXML
>     Homepage".
> 
>     To view already registered participants click on
> "Documents".
> 
>     Last Update:28 November 2000
> 
> The documents are an historic archive of no
> significance.  None.
> The other link -the ebXML website-- is two
> generations out of date.
> ebXML ended in May 2001 and ebTWG ended in Sep.
> 2002.  Yet,
> none of these links tells you that, directly.
> 
> Don't you think the above page is quite misleading? 
> Why does this
> continue year after year?  The page should say "The
> CEFACT
> ebXML Avtivity ended in May 2001 and was succeeded
> by its
> ebTWG Activity http://www.ebtwg.org
> 
> The CEFACT website is the place that should provide
> a top-down
> organization and presentation to the visitor. 
> Ironically the ebXML
> website's latest news link redirects the visitor to
> the Robin Cover
> page where a competent job is done explaining
> things. (Go here and
> click on latest news: "[02 Oct 2002] UN/CEFACT
> Releases
> ebXML Core Component Technical Specification for
> Second Public Review "
> It will take you to
> http://xml.coverpages.org/ni2002-10-01-a.html
> 
> And the CCTS is still nowhere to be found on any of
> these websites.
> In usual fashion, it has surfaced on the OAGIS CC
> mailing list on
> yahoogroups.  Most document distribution happens in
> such
> haphazard ways such as the WG's mailing list or 3rd
> party websites
> like www.collaborativedomain.com or Diffuse, or the
> UBL TC on OASIS.
> 
> As a participant who has contributed hundreds of
> hours to ebXML
> I am angry at the individual who maintains the
> UN/CEFACT website,
> and demand that they do a more responsible job of
> it.
> 
> As a minimum, the front page should be fixed:
> 
> - Whoever is controlling the UN/CEFACT front page
> should rename
> the  "XML Initiative" link to become "CEFACT Forum",
> its current
> name.
> 
> - Policy should be articulated as to what happens to
> old and
> current materials when the names of activities are
> changed.
> This is basic information management--the cobbler
> having no shoes.
> 
> - the CEFACT Forum site is quite unprofessional and
> should be
> corrected immediately.  Both that site and the
> CEFACT site
> show "UN/CEFACT FORUM 9-13 September 2002" as if it
> were
> future tense.   Get working and update the front
> pages of the
> sites to provide a more accurate, professional
> gateway.
> 
> - the CEFACT Forum site should provide a panel or
> index that
> displays the three time segments of ebXML
> (1999-2001, 2001-2002
> and the new Forum phase) including a very clear
> display of the REAL
> home page of each of those four Activities.  (ebXML,
> OASIS ebXML,
> 
=== message truncated ===


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