RE: [ebxml-msg] about async responses

Title: about async responses

Jeff: 

looks fine in 
general, with some minor comments:

 

- In (b), 
nothing actually requires the bundling of the RM 
Reply

to use the 
business response message (PO Ack ) that matches the request (PO) to be 
acknowledged.

An 
implementation of RMP is unlikely to be able to enforce this (the async business 
response being submitted

as a separate 
reliable request, the RMP has no knowledge of this 
correlation).

I see this 
bundling as something that will rather be driven by run-time contingencies: any 
reliable message submitted

the other 
side, is fair game for bundling... and if none is sent at the moment, the RMP 
may decide to just send

a 
separate callback message (as in (a)) after a 
while.

 

- in all your 
exchanges below,  you give the same "reply pattern" to both the PO message 
and the PO Ack message.

It does not 
have to be that way: the pattern used  from A to B does not have to be same 
as from B to A. 

 

Cheers,

 

Jacques

  
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Turpin 
  [mailto:]
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 
  2004 9:29 AM
To: Jacques Durand; 
  
Subject: RE: [ebxml-msg] about async 
  responses

  

  
I would like to 
  summarize where I think we are in terms of the use of WS-Reliablility for the 
  ebMS Request-Response MEP (Async). I typed this up rather quickly so I 
  apologize if my mock diagram is confusing. In addition I feel it will be 
  necessary to keep the ebXML MessageId and RefToMessageId elements to allow for 
  correlation of Async Request-Response messages.

  
 

  
ebMS 
  Request-Response MEP (Async):

  
 

  
      
  COMPANY_A                                                                                                                            
  COMPANY_B

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO BOD, etc.) ------à S-RMP.Submit 
  -------à R-RMP.Deliver 
  -----à Payload(PO BOD, etc.)

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO Ack BOD, etc.) ß------------ 
  R-RMP.Deliver <---------- S-RMP.Submit ß------------- 
  Payload(PO Ack BOD, 
  etc.)

  
 

  
RM-Reply 
  options:

  
 

  
a.       
  Callback 
  RM-Reply:

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO BOD, etc.) ------à S-RMP.Submit 
  ---------à R-RMP.Deliver 
  -----à Payload(PO BOD, etc.)

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  S-RMP  ß------------------------------------ 
  R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault))

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO Ack BOD, etc.) ß------------ 
  R-RMP.Deliver <------------- S-RMP.Submit ß------------- 
  Payload(PO Ack BOD, 
  etc.)

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault)) 
  ----------------------------------à 
  S-RMP

  
 

  
b.       
  Callback 
  RM-Reply(Bundled):

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO BOD, etc.) ------à 
  S-RMP.Submit   +   R-RMP.Deliver -----à Payload(PO BOD, etc.)

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO Ack BOD, etc.) ß------------ 
  R-RMP.Deliver ß------------- 
  (Payload + RM-Reply) S-RMP.Submit ß------------- 
  Payload(PO Ack BOD, 
  etc.)

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault)) 
  ----------------------------------à 
  S-RMP

  
 

  
c.       
  Poll 
  RM-Reply:

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO BOD, etc.) ------à 
  S-RMP.Submit   +   R-RMP.Deliver -----à Payload(PO BOD, etc.)

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  S-RMP(RM-PollRequest) ----------------------------------à 
  R-RMP

  
            
  Or

  
SOAP Request-Response 
  MEP: S-RMP(RM-PollRequest) 
  ----------------------------------à 
  R-RMP

  
 

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  S-RMP  ß------------------------------------ 
  R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault))

  
            
  Or

  
SOAP Request-Response 
  MEP: S-RMP  ß------------------------------------ 
  R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault) – Sent in SOAP 
  Response)

  
 

  
SOAP 
  One-way MEP: Payload (PO Ack BOD, etc.) ß------------ 
  R-RMP.Deliver <------------- S-RMP.Submit ß------------- 
  Payload(PO Ack BOD, 
  etc.)

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  R-RMP <--------------------------------- 
  S-RMP(RM-PollRequest)

  
            
  Or

  
SOAP Request-Response 
  MEP: R-RMP <--------------------------------- 
  S-RMP(RM-PollRequest)

  
 

  
SOAP One-way MEP: 
  R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault))  
  ----------------------------------à 
  S-RMP

  
            
  Or

  
SOAP Request-Response 
  MEP: R-RMP(RM-Reply(Ack or Fault) – Sent in SOAP Response)  
  ----------------------------------à 
  S-RMP

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  

  

  
  

  
From: Jacques 
  Durand [mailto:] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 10:54 
  AM
To: 
  ''
Subject: [ebxml-msg] about async 
  responses

  
 

  
 

  
Precision 
  on how reliable async "responses" could be handled: 
  

  
First a 
  reminder that ebMS Request-response MEP was implicit in ebMS 2.0 with 
  reftomessageid, 
and additionally for synchronous case, with 
  SyncReplyMode. 

  
Assuming 
  a more explicit notion of ebMS Request-response: 
When asynchronous, such an ebMS-level MEP 
  does not necessarily map to a single SOAP Request-response MEP instance (the 
  HTTP binding of which is - though not necessarily - commonly defined as an 
  HTTP Request-response).

  
An 
  asynchronous ebMS Request-response does not have to involve WS-R 
  Deliver+Respond. 
these two messages do not have to appear as a pair 
  Request / Response at RMP level: 
they may be handled as two unrelated SOAP messages 
  (submitted to RMP via "Submit" operation), and therefore subject to same 
  WS-Reliability handling (same RM features).

  
(They 
  could map to - for example - two SOAP One-way MEP instances.) 
  

  
This of 
  course does not hold for synchronous ebMS Request-responses, but then their 
  likely binding to 
an underlying synchronous protocol will not require 
  the same handling of reliability for Responses. 

  
Jacques