Good discussion.
A customer committed foreword
purchase can be quite different from a forecast. Some customers may be content to buy at
real-time prices. Others may decide
to hedge with a partial forward purchase and still other may speculate buying
more than they forecast and selling in real-time.
Edward G. Cazalet, Ph.D.
101 First Street, Suite 552
Los Altos, CA 94022
650-949-5274
cell: 408-621-2772
www.cazalet.com
From: Considine, Toby (Campus Services IT)
[mailto:]
Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 6:39 AM
To: 'Energy Interop'
Subject: RE: [energyinterop] Scope questions for discussion
No customer forecasts is today’s world, and is the reason
that DR is process rather than results oriented.
What is a committed forward purchase, but a customer forecast?
What is a forward looking purchase to support an industrial process but a
customer forecast. What is service centric DR but a forecast with a promise?
Toda’s utility was built upon all customer decisions being
mere noise in the over-abundance, With reduced operating margins stocks, that
overabundance is gone. With congestion pricing by a neighborhood, we have
reduced the crowd to individuals.
tc
"If flies are allowed to vote, how meaningful would a poll on
what to have for dinner be, and what would be on the menu?" -
Unknown
Toby Considine
Chair, OASIS oBIX Technical Committee
Co-Chair, OASIS Technical Advisory Board
Facilities Technology Office
University of North Carolina
Chapel Hill, NC
Email: Toby.Considine@
unc.edu
Phone: (919)962-9073
http://www.oasis-open.org
blog: www.NewDaedalus.com
From: Ed Cazalet [mailto:]
Sent: Tuesday, February 02, 2010 8:18 PM
To: Considine, Toby (Campus Services IT); 'Energy Interop'
Subject: RE: [energyinterop] Scope questions for discussion
The grid usually forecasts load in the aggregate. What is
the building forecast for? If it is a baseline for a DR program, then who
should be responsible for the forecast? The customer should not do it,
because of the incentive to bias the forecast.
Edward G. Cazalet, Ph.D.
101 First Street, Suite 552
Los Altos, CA 94022
650-949-5274
cell: 408-621-2772
www.cazalet.com
From: Considine, Toby (Campus Services IT)
[mailto:]
Sent: Tuesday, February 02, 2010 7:31 PM
To: Energy Interop
Subject: RE: [energyinterop] Scope questions for discussion
Traditionally, building load management has been crude, and
aggregated in certain large time granules. Industrial sites, however, have had
strong incentives to manage peaks.
As operating safety margins get smaller, it may become
increasingly important to manage peaks aggressively, even within the
neighborhood or even home. Is some sort of detailed peak /load shape of
interest in the new world? What about power factors? Is the forward and backward
reporting of curves rather than points of measurement the future of smart
metering?
tc
"If flies are allowed to vote, how meaningful would a poll on
what to have for dinner be, and what would be on the menu?" -
Unknown
Toby Considine
Chair, OASIS oBIX Technical Committee
Co-Chair, OASIS Technical Advisory Board
Facilities Technology Office
University of North Carolina
Chapel Hill, NC
Email: Toby.Considine@
unc.edu
Phone: (919)962-9073
http://www.oasis-open.org
blog: www.NewDaedalus.com
From: Sila Kiliccote
[mailto:]
Sent: Tuesday, February 02, 2010 6:09 PM
To: Energy Interop
Subject: [energyinterop] Scope questions for discussion
All,
David
Holmberg and I had a great conversation today on the scope of EI (which will
hopefully feed into section under discussion). I’d like to open up some
of my ideas and get your feedback before I propose a few paragraphs for the
scope section.
I’d
like to look at the scope from a B2G interface point of view and the questions
I suggest we try to answer are:
What information do the buildings need from the
electricity grid?
What information does the electricity grid need from
the buildings?
Buildings’ need from the Grid:
-
Electricity prices (various forms such as absolute, relative, level,
etc)
-
DR contract parameters – excluding direct load control: A contract
can have the following parameters:
- Issue time,
start time, end time
-
Within the start time and end time there may be a request from the grid
for load reduction (%, absolute, relative, etc) (or load increase - when there
is too much generation)
- Power quality (Do we care how “good” the power
we get from the Grid? Probably! What are the indicators to be communicated to a
building?
- Location of the resources needed
Grid’s
need from buildings:
-
Measured (current, historical) demand
-
Predicted demand
-
Available DR (over next 24 hrs?, 1 week?)
- Location identifier (meter, address, grid location
indicator?)
I
welcome your comments. All of the above assumes that the meter is the
demarcation point. And just to add, the expansion of this to DER can be again
categorized as on the utility side and on the building side but should be a
super set.
Sila
