Not all those SDOs make all their standards
available 'free'. IEEE as a general rule sells published standards; some groups,
such as 802, have made arrangements to provide published standards free (some
company/companies have contributed money to IEEE a fee to make
this possible). You can get any 802 standard after a few months of initial
publication (6 months I think) for free at http://standards.ieee.org/getieee802/.
As Erich has commented, a lot of work and resources
go into creating standards. Face to face meetings are still a requirement in
most SDOs to be have voting rights. Attending meetings is expensive.
In IEEE-SA we pay fees to attend meetings and to be a member of the IEEE-SA, pay
travel considerable expenses (and the cost of the time), and spend hours in
lines at airports, taxi stops, hotel check-in, etc. Participation in multiple
SDOs strains the budget and makes one's dog likely to forget what you look like.
Believe it or not, people do it anyway, even some who can't justify the expense
using normal business rules. Not
complaining, just reinforcing what has been said - it takes some dedicated
people who must really believe in the value of standards to get
involved.
In my experiences in IEEE 802 standards, there are
people who make significant contributions despite being unable to make face to
face meetings. While it is not always acknowledged, it is possible. The
more "open" an SDO, by which I mean the easier it is for individuals to
participate, the better the result, in my opinion. The quality of the
standard as well as the success of it in industry both benefit from broad
participation. But that's just my opinion, which with $3 will get you a
cup of coffee....
-Ben
----- Original Message -----
From:
Michaela Barnes
To: Toby Considine
Cc:
Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2009 12:58
PM
Subject: Re: [smartgrid-discuss] What
Standards do we need for the Smart Grid
There are a number of standards groups that do not charge to
view their standards: IETF, W3C, ECMA, OMA, IEEE, ETSI and OASIS
(Toby's favorite) come to mind. And, sometimes the process goes through a
non-paid organization (say IEEE Computer Socicety) which is not paid, gets
recognized by an organization that does charge...so you get to pick which
version you want to use, when much of the time they are the same thing just
with different approvals, numbers, and cover pages.
Michaela
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 9:27 AM, Toby Considine <> wrote:
Moving
this thread back into the open...
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 8:31 AM, Rajesh Koilpillai
<> wrote:
I
would think so too, but wouldn't it be a major re-engineering effort. Do
you have any rough timelines for these standards to evolve and mature?
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 5:43 PM, Toby Considine
<> wrote:
It
is regrettable but true, that the IEC standards are "pay per view". Some
think this a a good reason for smart grid standards to be developed
elsewhere...
tc
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 7:03 AM, Rajesh Koilpillai
<> wrote:
Hi
Toby,
Thanks for the excellent summary on the smart grid
requirements. You have made references to ISO 61850
in the thread below, is this a specification which is available
for public download? It seems to be re-directing me to a site,
which doesn't seem to contain any public downloads. Can you point me
in the right direction.
Thanks very much,
- Rajesh Koilpillai
On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 7:49 AM, Toby Considine
<> wrote:
I have had the pleasure of some stimulating conversations in the
last few days about a standards roadmap for the smart grid. As I
often do when pondering, I blog to crystallize my thoughts. THis is
what came out...
http://www.newdaedalus.com/articles/2009/2/27/what-standards-do-we-need-for-the-smart-grid-sgix.html
What Standards do we need for the Smart Grid
As I do periodically, I have been thinking about what standards
we need for the smart grid. The smart grid is more than improved
top-down control, it is a grid ready for unreliable energy sources
(such as wind, waves, and sun), distributed generation, and net zero
energy buildings. Net zero energy buildings are particularly
troublesome because from minute to minute, they may be buy power or
selling power. The smart grid will be transactional, with each
purchase of energy at a market clearing price. The smart grid will
be open and transparent, wherein consumers can choose what kind of
power to buy, and providers can prove that they are selling the kind
of power they promise.
Earlier this week, Alex Levinson named the smart grid standards
Smart Grid Information Exchange (SGIX). So what are the standards we
need for SGIX?
-
SG Pricing: Price is more than a number. If I
ask you if prices are up or down at the store, the answer is not
“7”. It is not “Tomatoes are $3.00.” The price is “$3:57 per pound
for the organic vine-ripened greenhouse heritage Cherokee tomatoes.”
Each buyer can choose which attributes affect their purchase
decision. I may choose to buy the cheapest tomatoes. I may choose to
buy only organic. I may grudgingly choose the most expensive because
they are the only ones in the store. And I will be able to choose to
run the fountain in front of my office only when wind power is
available and below a certain price.
-
SG Transaction: I buy what I buy at the time
that I buy it. That transaction may be different because of my price
decisions than what my neighbor is buying at the same time. I may
owe for that purchase of solar power to my utility or to my
neighbor.
-
SG Market Operations: There is some bidding and
exchange of information in advance. In my mind, this looks somewhat
like commodity markets for those who want to participate. It
includes elements of weather arbitrage. It includes time and
reliability. It includes all of the elements of price. I am looking
forward to GridEcon in March to begin the discussions on SG Market
Operations.
-
UnitsML: UnitsML offers an unambiguous way to
describe all physical measurements, and an unambiguous ability for a
computer to look up the translation of any units of measure to any
other units. I think UnitsML will be part of pricing and market
operations.
-
WS Calendar: We all use ICALENDAR to
unambiguously exchange information about time intervals. You used it
the last time you clicked on an email attachment and suddenly had a
meeting on your personal calendar. We need the same functionality
standardized for web services. We will use it as part of pricing,
and weather predictions, and other decisions.
-
WeatherML v2: I don’t actually know what
version WeatherML is on – but it is not usable. Most forward looking
energy markets are based on assumptions about weather. Most
historical analysis of energy use includes recalling the weather
environment. The most successful energy middleman base their
business on understanding microclimates. We need a standard way to
report weather information, in whatever detail is available, from
forecasters, local weather stations, personal weather systems. Such
a standard should include UnitsML (for internationalization) as well
as time (WS-Calendar) and probabilities (for forecasts).
-
SG Interoperation: I envision this as a short,
light, exchange of the information we need to plug technologies
together without knowing the details. I see it as smaller than, but
perhaps derived from, ISO-61850. It includes some basic safety
information. It includes estimates of reliability and capacity. It
may include some of the “price attributes” (Am I a source of
carbon-credit eligible power?).
-
SG Metering: This is a simple standard of
energy flows by time slice. It also includes direction, as power may
flow one way for a time, and then the other in a distributed
world.
-
oBIX: The web service standard for
technology-agnostic operation or distributed control systems could
well have a place Remote Operation and Telemetry.
-
SG Telemetry: What is going on on the grid, and
where is it failing.
-
WS DD and WS DP: Device discovery and device
profiles have been used in computer networking for some time. Device
Discovery lets you find all printers on the network,. Device
profiles let you decide which printer to use when you want color
duplexing. These functions are being standardized for the web.
Schneider, one of the largest conglomerates providing systems for
the grid and building is looking at providing WS DD and WS DP for
all the equipment it sells. I think it will have a big role in the
future world of distributed generation and net zero energy.
-
SG Remote Operation: This one may be a literal
transform from the ISO 61850 standard for substation communications.
Have I missed any?
--
________________________________________
"When one door
closes, another opens; but we often look so long and so regretfully
upon the closed door that we do not see the one which has opened for
us." -- Alexander Graham
Bell
________________________________________
Toby
Considine
Chair, OASIS oBIX TC http://www.oasis-open.org
Co-Chair, OASIS
Technical Advisory Board
TC9, Inc
Phone:
(919)619-2104
blog: www.NewDaedalus.com
--
________________________________________
"When one door closes,
another opens; but we often look so long and so regretfully upon the
closed door that we do not see the one which has opened for us." --
Alexander Graham
Bell
________________________________________
Toby
Considine
Chair, OASIS oBIX TC http://www.oasis-open.org
Co-Chair, OASIS
Technical Advisory Board
TC9, Inc
Phone:
(919)619-2104
blog: www.NewDaedalus.com
--
- Rajesh
Koilpillai
--
________________________________________
"When one door closes,
another opens; but we often look so long and so regretfully upon the closed
door that we do not see the one which has opened for us." -- Alexander
Graham Bell
________________________________________
Toby
Considine
Chair, OASIS oBIX TC http://www.oasis-open.org
Co-Chair, OASIS Technical
Advisory Board
TC9, Inc
Phone:
(919)619-2104
blog: www.NewDaedalus.com
